Ali Toothman on KDP Account Termination

Tanner: 00:00:00

On today's episode of Killer Prose, I talk to author Allie Toothman.

Ali writes horror for readers who want to get into the deepest parts of a character's mind.

She is the author of Abby Lives and is featured in various horror anthologies.

Since making multiple therapists cry, she's taken her trauma and real life demons and processes them through the fictional world she creates.

You can usually find her buried in a book, watching documentaries and avoiding ceiling fans.

And recently she's gone through a nightmare that all indie authors have creeping around in the backs of their brain.

Her KDP account was terminated and we're going to be talking about that right now.

Tanner: 00:01:10

Welcome back to the Killer Pros podcast.

I'm your host and fellow author Tanner, and today I am joined in the virtual studio by Ali Toothman.

Allie recently went through the thing that we're all scared to death of as indie horror authors.

Her KDP account was terminated.

So we're going to talk about that today.

What she's gone through, steps she's taken.

And we're going to talk about the process of getting terminated by Amazon.

I do want to preface this by saying that, yeah, it's very, very rare that someone is kicked off of Amazon and there's absolutely no policy violation.

So I want you guys to listen all the way through the story so you can hear exactly the steps that were taken, the communications and what went down with kdp.

Companies, especially ones as large as Amazon, have very confusing, sometimes conflicting policies and that's something that they do to protect themselves.

But when these decisions are made by AI, problems happen.

So Ali, I'm sorry this happened, but if you would just take from the top and let us know like how this started with, with KDP.

Ali Toothman: 00:02:19

Okay, so in: 2023

I had been in a pretty bad horseback riding accident.

And with that sur I had to completely relearn how to walk.

That took about a year for me to be able to walk unassisted.

So I was in bed a lot.

I was bored out of my mind and I was just looking for things to do.

And I came across on TikTok, like print on demand and low and no content books on kdp, which is like journals and notebooks.

So I learned how to do that and I had, I've used Etsy in the past, so I had some experience there.

And because they were all so similar, other than like their covers, I basically listed them the exact same way.

I might change one or two keywords just like based on the description of the COVID so like Boho Journal instead of Pineapple Journal.

And my account got terminated.

I reached out to them and I sent probably four emails asking like, what is the violation?

What did I do wrong?

And they would not tell me.

And they just kept saying that their, their stance is not going to change and they're not going to reinstate my account.

tarted writing Libby lives in: 2024

And then my Author Central account was under Ali Toothman, because that's what I publish under.

I published that in February: 2025

I don't know if they linked it through acx because when I made my account through ACX to get the audiobook up, that's when the first termination of my new account was done.

I did research on like, why my account could get terminated for the low and no content because as you said, like, their terms and conditions are very confusing.

I looked into them more and just the main portion has 10 points and each has their own little sub point.

So like, it's very, very dense.

I found that with the low and no content books, they can see it as spam if you're not changing too much, either spam or a bot.

And so when I talked to somebody in February, I explained the whole situation and they responded.

They said they were going to take a couple days, they were going to look at the accounts, and then they reinstated both of my accounts.

In the meantime, I had reached out to Joe Meinhart at Crystal Lake Publishing and I had talked to him a few times.

We had a good kind of like work relationship, you know, and he actually decided to pick up Libby Libs and re release it through Crystal Lake.

And I'm so thankful for him, especially since this has come around again.

In February, they reinstated my account.

And then in August, I took Libby Lives down from my KDP so that everything could be transferred to Crystal Lake.

I reached out to KDP support to get my accounts merged and the person said she wanted to wait until my royalties were paid out.

She said she would put a note to follow up and she did.

And it got merged, the accounts got merged together.

Everything was fine.

I was given no warning, no nothing.

And then I reached out to Author Central to have my Author Central account transferred over because it wasn't moved with the merge.

And then like the next day I get an email that my account is terminated.

And I responded with, you know, I know I had two accounts.

I went through this in February.

Here is the confirmation email about it being reinstated.

I went through the proper channels to get my accounts merged.

You know, I know I messed up and that's why I going through the proper steps to fix it, you know, and they just kept saying that their decision stands and they're not going to reinstate my account.

I think I sent four or five emails and even asking them like, why is my account being terminated?

And they are just telling me that I violated the terms and conditions and that they will not reinstate my account.

Tanner: 00:07:00

Unfortunately, that's, that's something that happens to a lot of author and there's millions of ways to, to get your KDP account terminated.

It happened to you at a very interesting time because you're just starting your writing career really, and currently your works like Libby Lives, it was picked up by Crystal Lake Publishing.

Your other works are in other anthologies.

You're in a good place where your stuff isn't completely taken down off of Amazon.

Most people don't find themselves there.

I do want to say, like you, you knew, okay, this is the rationale behind why my account was terminated.

Why the bots picked me to pick you.

Went through the channels, got it reinstated.

What's interesting in your case is this is the first one that I've heard of where they did a reversal and they opened your account back up, merged them together, and then suddenly killed it again.

The communication there at the end that just happened where they, they said, this is a final decision.

We're, we're keeping it closed.

The turnaround time on that makes me think it's probably a bottom.

Unfortunately, when you're going through things with KDP and Amazon, you're dealing with bots first.

When you do finally magically make it through to a person and it's escalated to okay, I'll get a human agent.

Those people have in most cases less decision making power than the AI that originally terminated the account and they won't cop to it.

But there are penalties for going against, literally going against the machine.

But you have to escalate it up until you get to someone that can look at it and say, all right, this, this, you're not a bad player.

This was an honest mistake when you were first starting out.

Let's give you a redo.

Yeah.

Or you know what?

We already, we're going to uphold our original decision and bring this KDP thing back.

But it is so freaking hard to get through to one of those supervisors or one of those people who actually have authority.

And I mean, for most of us publishing indie Horror.

Our readership is in kdp.

And I talked about this a little bit last week.

The reason why so many of us go exclusive to Amazon, including publishing houses like Wicked House, to be inside of ku, is because that's where the biggest indie readership is.

Now.

I think most of them are there primarily because they feel like they have to.

Indie horror readers tend to be rebels.

I think that they would follow and go to Kobo if most of us went white.

Yeah, that's why my backlist, you know, my.

I am publishing and going directly into, into KDP for a period of three to six months, but then I'm bouncing out and going wide because those other platforms do have readers who are asking, hey, where are the.

The horror writers?

And there are people in KU that are saying, hey, we would love to go to Kobo and get away from Amazon.

But it doesn't help.

Like, a lot of people, like, there have been authors who've been publishing for 20 years.

They have their entire catalog there on Amazon.

And Amazon is still, even though they are wide, a lot of them, when they lose Amazon, they lose 70 to 80% of their sales.

So it is, it is a massive cut to, to people in the, in the horror industry, in the publishing industry in general.

That's why I say we're healthier going wide.

Ali Toothman: 00:10:20

I have, I've had a lot of people, even not even just my own books, Like, I've had people tell me, like, if I didn't have, if Libby Lives wasn't on ku, I would have never read it or I would have never found it.

And I feel like because of that, we are just stuck in a sense, if we're publishing ourselves and we're not on Amazon, then we're not going to get found.

I mean, like Barnes and Noble, for example, if, if you have your book listed on IngramSpark, they can order it through Barnes and Noble.

But the thing is, is if it's under $14.99, they won't sell it.

But also, I've done signings at my local Barnes and Noble and they are not allowed to order indie books.

Like, if I want my book in Barnes and Noble, I have to bring it up and sell it on consignment because the company will not let them order from independent publishers.

Tanner: 00:11:24

Interesting.

I didn't know that about, about Barnes and Noble.

The one here has an entire indie local section.

So I'll talk to them about that.

Ali Toothman: 00:11:33

They're not allowed to here, because he did initially, the manager, he had ordered them and he's had me come in for a signing and I have another one coming up.

But after the first time like corporate reached out to him and told him like you can't order these.

Like she needs to bring them herself.

It has to be on the Barnes and Noble website so that they have the ISBN and whatnot and they can charge for it.

But I have to provide the books.

Tanner: 00:12:03

Interesting.

I know with if you're doing hard copies on the website and they're sold digitally, they're just ran through draft two digital IngramSpark or whoever, whoever you're ordering from there.

But yeah, and I don't worry about shelf space when it comes to that because I know most of my people are going to be online.

Ali Toothman: 00:12:21

Yeah.

Tanner: 00:12:21

But yeah, that is, that is concerning.

Ali Toothman: 00:12:24

And that's just another thing that's against independent authors and makes things harder, especially horror authors because I mean horror is definitely making a comeback, but it is, it's still not the biggest genre, you.

Tanner: 00:12:40

Know, like romantasy romance dominates.

Dominates the shelves, dominates cells.

What I like about horror is that is a stable genre so you can build a very stable career because the fans are fans for life.

It's not a trend that goes up and down.

I mean it does in like the mass market.

But since Leisure Books closed, I don't think we're going to see the mass market horror days of the, you know, the 80s and the 90s.

But yeah, with, with Amazon, that is where the majority of indie books are sold right now.

There's a lot of compet.

It's.

It's not the end of your career.

Say you do get bumped off of Amazon and you go through, you do the research, you find out exactly why and you're gonna have to do the legwork.

They're not gonna tell you you found out that you were.

It was the, the content of those original notebooks that you published that got you kicked off.

A lot of times you just get a generic email that says you terminated our, our use policies.

That could mean anything.

It could be the content itself.

Something that a lot of people don't know is that meta shares data with Amazon.

So if you're giving away links to your books or asking for reviews for your books inside of private messages with people, Amazon sees that and that's a terms violation.

So you lose your KDP account.

So, and they don't tell you that.

And they're not going to tell you that.

They'll just say it's up to you to figure out what you did.

What I have heard and if you guys want to check it out?

I'm going to, I'm going to link to it.

Down in the show notes.

There was a podcast episode that was done on novel marketing by Thomas Upstead Jr. Where he brought in an expert who works with authors and helps them get their KDP accounts back.

Who went through all of this?

The, the numbers on it, the tricks that Amazon uses, stuff that you can do, email addresses to, to send things through, and resources if your KDP account was terminated to help you get it back.

And basically it comes down to don't take no for an answer.

Now, if you're at a place where you're fed up and you're like, I'm going to go my separate ways from Amazon and I'm going to build my readership in other places, or you're going to go the traditional route, then more power to you.

I hope it works.

But if you're trying to get back into KDP and make sure that you're building, building your career in a sustainable way, I would love to get away from Amazon.

Just FYI, don't take no for an answer.

When I was in sales, a part of this is because I spent so long as a private investigator, spent 15 years there and then I spent like a decade in sales.

I bu out of people and I don't care.

So if something happens, I'm going to this guy, I'm going to that guy, I'm going to this girl, I'm going to this bot and I'm going to keep going until I get the answer that I want or restraining order definitely, when it comes to my career.

So don't give up is the big thing while doing that though.

I mean, you're in a very interesting position coming out of this from Amazon.

You have traditionally published works.

You're planning on reaching out to agents and going the traditional routes.

And then there are, are a ton of avenues, especially in certain sub genres of horror that you can tap and have a bigger readership outside of Amazon with that wide approach, we'll say ignoring Amazon.

If you're someone who is like, you know what I really want to build wide.

It is a slower ramp up to go wide because you have to learn several different platforms.

It's one of the reasons that I love Draft 2 Digital so much because it puts it all there in one dashboard.

They're not sponsors.

I just, I love what they're doing over there.

But you can do it.

It just takes two to three times as long because it doesn't have the marketing power that this beast has.

Ali Toothman: 00:16:13

Yeah.

With Crystal Lake picking up Libby Lives, that has been.

Well, one.

It gives me that, like, security that my book's not going to disappear.

But it also helps so much from the marketing aspect.

I mean, I love Libby Lives so much, but so much of the time that I could be putting into writing has been spent with marketing and making content and stuff like that.

But like you said, I'm.

I am in a. I'm in a position that not a lot of people are in, where I have relationships with publishers and friends who have connections and, you know, willing to help out.

I do a lot in the community before.

Before I was a writer, I was a reader, and I still am.

I mean, I just finished my 125th book of the year, but I made a lot of connections before I even started writing, so I have more of a step up than a lot of people do.

But there are a lot of resources, like you said, you know, there's the podcast that breaks everything down.

There's Draft two digital.

If I plan to self publish, what I'm planning to do is, like, I will likely only do, like, exclusives and just have them printed through IngramSpark.

That's what I did.

Make a special edition of Libby Lives.

And I've just been printing those myself through IngramSpark and selling them direct.

But it is a lot of legwork to go wide, especially when you have the stress of having your account terminated.

That really, like, kind of nails it down.

That's why I was like, you know what?

I was already planning on querying.

I'm not.

I don't have the mental capacity to fight with Amazon at this time.

Tanner: 00:18:09

And you already fought once.

And that's.

That's kind of what floors me is they reversed the decision.

They opened your account back up and said, all right, let's.

Let's get this going.

You did nothing wrong after that.

And then it came back around and said, you know what?

We changed our mind.

We're getting rid of your account.

That one floors me.

I have a feeling.

Probably a bot decision, but.

Ali Toothman: 00:18:30

And.

And what's crazy is I went like, I went through KDP customer support, and I was talking to someone on, like, a live agent on the chat, and then she said that she wanted to wait until my royalties cleared in my bank account and then she would reach out in a couple days after.

And we did.

And I was working with a human, and I went through the proper channels and explained, you know, this is what happened, and this is why I need to merge the accounts and whatever.

And then I just abruptly get the message that they're.

Oh, just kidding.

You can't have your account.

Tanner: 00:19:11

That.

Tanner: 00:19:12

Yeah, I, I absolutely hate that for you.

But like you said, there are ways forward.

Ali Toothman: 00:19:18

Yeah.

Tanner: 00:19:19

There are authors out there who their, their biggest sales come from their direct sales, not necessarily Amazon.

Now these are people with big backlists that have been doing this for a while.

Ali Toothman: 00:19:29

Oh my gosh.

Have you seen.

Are you friends with Aaron Beauregard on Facebook?

Tanner: 00:19:33

I'm not.

Ali Toothman: 00:19:34

Oh, my God.

So when he releases a new book, he has stacks along a wall that are probably up to his armpit and he is a tall guy.

Just an entire wall of books for him to sign and send.

I mean, he's posted pictures of his entire truck bed full of packages of signed books when he's released them or released special editions.

Like.

And he doesn't put his books on ku, he sells them wide because he doesn't want to be stuck like a lot of us are.

Tanner: 00:20:12

I haven't seen the data on it, but I would like to see side by side the authors who are getting booted from KU or, sorry, booted from Amazon, period kdp.

The number or the percentage of those who are in KU because it is so much more restrictive and the policies are a bit more confusing there.

As opposed to the authors who are wide, because I do know several authors who had their works pirated.

They were in Amazon or Kindle select and they got booted.

Some of them got suspended temporarily, some of them got kicked out of select and could still sell wide, and some of them got kicked off the platform altogether.

Ali Toothman: 00:20:49

Aaron Beauregard's actually one of the ones who.

I think he had it.

The copyright, I think, is what it is.

I don't know, like the super technical stuff.

But when they had the big lawsuit, a cup, I think it was last year, he ended up getting a payout because he had filed for copyright and whatnot on his books legally, not just like as intellectual property.

And his books were taken for AI.

And he is a very strong supporter of doing that even before that happened.

But the people whose.

So with that, you know, not only did a lot of people lose their accounts because their books were pirated or were fed to AI, but they also didn't get any compensation from the lawsuit because they didn't go through the Congress.

Copyright?

Is that what it's called?

Tanner: 00:21:51

Yeah.

Tanner: 00:21:51

So there's a.

Tanner: 00:21:52

And I'm doing this with all my books.

I recommend everybody listening to this podcast as you're going through your Pre launch checklist, register with the US Copyright Office so that you have a defendable position.

Now.

Yeah, technically the work is copywritten as soon as it's published.

When you, technically when you finish writing it, it is yours.

It is copywritten and you have a hell of a mess to defend that.

If you don't pay the $65, fill out the application and register that with the Copyright Office.

In these large class action lawsuits like we're seeing with AI, if you don't have the registered copyright or registered trademark, you don't get a dime.

That's where the protection is.

Another thing that we're seeing with authors getting kicked off of kdp, period is from piracy.

So people will steal the books, change the name.

Wicked House just went through this where they took the interiors of the books, changed the name, put new AI covers and slop on them and then put them out as new books.

Now there are some scammers who are taking that a step further and saying that they have the copyright to that and they're getting the original author kicked off by filing copyright claims or causing just a big mess.

That is a pain in the ass to deal with for the author by filing a copyright claim.

If you have that piece of paper that shows I have a registered copyright with the United States government.

When you send that in, that's basically an automatic check.

These are robots.

Even the people are robots at the level that when it first comes in and it's like he's got the document check mark, it's his book.

Ali Toothman: 00:23:26

Yeah.

Tanner: 00:23:26

Like this is, this is a nightmare.

But there's always a way forward.

So like with, with you, there's, there's a way forward going traditional.

There's a way forward training your readership.

Because this happened early, people aren't trained to go into KU to look for you go go into Amazon.

So if you start pushing people to Barnes Noble, you start pushing people to Hoopla or to their local library.

A lot of people don't know we get paid.

When people check out our books as indie authors, we get a royalty from every checkout from Hoopla.

I think we get something from Libby too.

And it's a way for people to experience those books for free.

They can download an ePub, pop it on their Kindle if they want to.

They can link those two things together if they like that reading experience.

And we get paid a flat rate.

Not a page, not a per page thing.

Ali Toothman: 00:24:08

Yeah.

And with KU, it's like.005 cents per page read.

Tanner: 00:24:15

If you're lucky.

It's 0.004 something if you're not in that top percentage.

Ali Toothman: 00:24:21

Yeah, that's right.

It's.

Yeah, we get paid less.

A lot of people don't even know, like, we get paid less than a penny per page.

I mean so.

And like you said, you have to train your readers, but like you have to put yourself out there.

I mean, the month that I had the most reads was, I think June, because I am in the Haunted Minds book club.

And to my complete surprise, Libby Lives made it into the graveyard rumble, which is just like vote for your favorite book kind of thing.

I was not surprised to see that John Ward won with a blackened heart, a blackened soul.

That book was phenomenal.

But I made it in the top 24 and I had I think close to 10,000 page reads in a month.

And that's the most that I've ever gotten.

So finding groups like on Facebook and like growing your social media, that also helps you to get new readers because like on Instagram I've been posting, you know, Libby Lives got picked up by Crystal Lake Publishing and treat the authors sale.

So use this code and go order my book from them and instead of Amazon.

And I've gotten a lot of sales that way because you're telling, you have to tell your readers where the best place to buy your book is as indies.

Tanner: 00:25:51

Also, we're not looking at selling millions of copies.

We're not USA Today, New York Times bestseller.

Those are cool marketing tools.

Those don't necessarily calculate into dollars.

But unlike going through large publishing companies, we're in an opportunity to have a handful of a few thousand superfans that buy all of our stuff, interact with the all of the different formats.

Dungeon crawler Carl's a good one.

I have all of the audiobooks.

I also have the hardcovers.

I also have whatever merch he's got.

I love that book.

I love that story.

Tanner: 00:26:22

In that world.

Tanner: 00:26:23

We as horror authors have an opportunity to do that with micro audiences and bring them to a podcast or bring those into the books in a more immersive experience.

So there's a way forward.

It's not the end.

It's a pain in the ass when KDP throws something at you, but it's not the end.

Ali Toothman: 00:26:41

Well, and so a lot of people don't know this, but I was actually a social media influencer for five years and a lot of people don't realize that like your Facebook account can be monetized and like, so another way for you to have income is to be active like on meta, on Facebook, on Instagram.

And something that I've learned is, you know, I have my Bookstagram account.

It's connected to my monetized Facebook account.

And just by having your friends share your posts and comment like, every single view, I make more money a month from Facebook than I was from my book.

Being on ku, like, social media does make a big difference.

And the more eyes you get on your content, even if it's not your own book, that's going to bring in more followers, that's going to bring in more people.

Seeing your book like that is how a lot of people have found my book is just because, like, if I post a reading list, like a reading recommendation list, I include my book on there and it's, you know, social media is annoying.

It's a lot of work when you really put your foot into it, but it makes a huge difference and it changes.

Tanner: 00:28:07

So, like, you'll learn one platform.

It'll like.

I think MySpace is trying to make a comeback right now, but having that decentralized business, that decentralized brand across multiple platforms, it builds in some security.

So as a, as a podcast, when I launched, Apple was the place where everything was at.

Now, I worked very hard with my podcasts and I tracked the numbers of downloads from Apple to other podcasting apps.

Having a pod page and a website that's built that shows everywhere that you can listen to my podcast has helped in diversifying killer pros and diversifying truly odd.

My other show.

So that now if something happens and Apple, which we're all kind of nervous they're going to stop doing podcasts and stop featuring that.

I've spread my audience out across all, all of these other apps and platforms and social media and TikTok, we have an entirely different revenue stream coming in there.

We have like the T shirt sales and different merch sales and stuff for that affiliate marketing here for the podcast.

When you're building a business, we talk about the wheel of business.

Every revenue stream is a spoke, and the more spokes that wheel has, the stronger your business is.

So don't, don't put everything in one spoke and have like this lopsided business that's just kind of clunking along.

I think that's probably the biggest takeaway from this and from seeing so many authors go through this with.

With kdp.

Ali Toothman: 00:29:27

Yeah.

Yeah.

Tanner: 00:29:28

I think it might be worth having you back on to talk about author social media.

Ali Toothman: 00:29:33

I would love to.

And I also do all of the social media marketing for shivercon.

Tanner: 00:29:38

Oh, cool.

Ali Toothman: 00:29:39

Yeah.

I am.

Well, last year I was the co organizer for shivercon alongside Brandon Eldridge.

I'm still the shivercon assistant regional manager, but I won't have as much on my hands for next year.

But I do all of the social media and I was kind of writing on Medium, but I was doing website and social media audits for small businesses.

I started off with my stepdad, who he does prosthetics.

And so I went through his website, I went through his Facebook, which he'd made like three posts in 10 years, and I made a marketing plan for him, and I did that for a while.

And I love social media marketing, so I would love to help you with that.

Tanner: 00:30:27

I think you've got a really strong foundation to be able to move wide.

Having, like, having that, being able to connect with people, being able to influence readers, your connections there with Shiver Khan.

I think.

I think you're gonna do.

You're gonna do well.

Ali Toothman: 00:30:40

Thank you.

Tanner: 00:30:41

Thank you so much for coming on.

Let us know where.

Where can readers find you?

You said you were selling some special editions of Libby Lives.

Ali Toothman: 00:30:49

Yes.

So I have a big cartel website, but you can just message me directly on Facebook or Instagram.

On Instagram, it's Ali's Book Nook, but I'm Ali Toothman, and like I said earlier, Crystal Lake is having a Treat the Author Sale.

So if you buy a book from Crystal Lake, the authors make more in royalties because they're cutting out the middleman.

So you can get Libby Lives, which has a new.

It's a new addition through Crystal Lake.

So there's a new introduction from Megan Stockton.

Blaine Daigle curated a Femrage playlist.

And then at the end, there's a novelette that combines or not combines.

It connects Libby Lives to the second book, Libby's Wrath, and it is on Amazon too.

Through Crystal Lake.

Tanner: 00:31:44

Yeah, you can't totally discount.

They are, What, I think, 85% of the market this year.

Ali Toothman: 00:31:49

Yeah.

But it is slipping with the Treat the Authors sale.

If you use the code Treat the author, you get 20 off at Crystal Lake.

Tanner: 00:31:58

Oh, awesome.

Yeah, I'll make sure to include all that down in the show notes.

Allie, thanks so much for coming on.

All right, stick around.

I have some.

Some other things and some announcements to talk about, and then we'll scoot out.

Thanks for coming.

Ali Toothman: 00:32:10

Thanks.

Tanner: 00:32:12

Thanks for listening today.

This is an issue that's been affecting authors for a while, and I honestly don't know if it's getting better or if it's getting worse.

But after today's conversation.

I am looking.

I really want to just skip going into KU altogether, but I think I will do at least three months in there.

I don't know.

It's something that I'm thinking about.

Ali Toothman: 00:32:38

Anyway.

Tanner: 00:32:38

A couple of updates.

You'll notice that the Killer Pros website is looking different.

That is linking and being more of like a sub domain type thing.

Under my author website, I am consolidating things so that I don't just have a brand here that I'm trying to market, a brand over there that I'm trying to market and getting all of this different stuff that's just pulling money and focus in different directions.

So I'm trying to really just simplify everything.

So connect with me over@tannerruutledgebooks.com there'll be a spot there there to link over to the podcast, which is a much simpler page than it was.

It's basically just a place for the podcast to live online and have links to different places to check it out.

That's the big changes with the podcast.

The book is still still in editing and is on track to come out mid November.

Really excited to have that book out and released as soon as it's done.

I'm going to be working with Kristen to get the audiobook finished for that and I'll be talking a little bit about some of the work that I'm doing on the audiobook.

With all that, I would say my focus is shifting back over to audio with the stories that I'm writing after this one.

Really focused on writing those for the audiobook and various audio adaptations and having that be my lead.

If I can find a way to make that work and replace what I think I might have made on ku, I might start launching my books wide.

I'm going to be talking about that coming up.

It's just kind of something that's rolling around in my head that I'm spitballing.

Yeah.

So that's what I'm working on.

Those are my thoughts right now.

Stay tuned.

Again, connect with me over@tanner rutledgebooks.com Sign up for the newsletter so you know when the books are coming out.

You'll also see the updates there.

If anything's changing, anything's amiss, or if things are going great, you can find those on my author updates.

Cool.

All right, that's it.

I am out.

Thank you guys so much.

And until the next time, enjoy the process.